Team New Zealand are in a very strong position for the future. Given where they were in 2003, which was in a shambles, they are now right there with huge assets, huge intellectual knowledge and huge passion and belief.
They have got there through very good leadership, good recruitment and good design where the sailors have had a lot of input.
The key was making early decisions. They built and launched their first new boat, NZL84, early. It was quite a radical looking boat but came out of the box pretty good. NZL92 was a refined version.
They made early decisions on big components, like their four spreader rigs, what hull they were going to use, they locked their sail programme in early, shapes of mainsails, genoas, their bulb shapes.
They also locked their crew in early. They made good strategic moves.
They also got funding relatively early which allowed them to do that, something which will again be vital for the future.
It is important they get back into the design process quickly. Alinghi had an edge. It is not a generation edge but it is an edge. The challenge for Team New Zealand and all the other challengers is to find out where and how have they squeezed out a little more performance.
For a lot of the teams it is “rebuild” time. Oracle are going to come back extremely strong if they get Russell Coutts, Luna Rossa will regroup and then there are new teams like Origin who are going to kick off.
It is going to be hard.
I thought if Team New Zealand didn’t win the America’s Cup it would be all over.
But the yachting public and general public have realised the Team New Zealand brand is an asset. It is bigger than yachting, it is bigger than Team New Zealand – here we are in Europe and brand New Zealand is out there.
Under Grant Dalton’s leadership the team will always have “a feet on the ground approach”, they will remain non flashy and uncomplicated. If that changes maybe then it is time to give it away but not now.
This is the wrong time to give it away. Sure the team is absolutely gutted. But when you are trying to motivate people down the track you go back to how they felt the day after they got beaten by just one second.
The fire still burns.
Gidday Guys, Gidday Peter! I am just come back from Valencia…what a wonderful place, full of emotions! Everyday I used to spend a walk around the America’s cup area, especially around ETNZ’s base. I saw Winston Macfarlane outside the base ( just in front of me!) and somebody of the staff. We have to wait for some days to know more about the 33th America’s cup location, and I can tell you that I hope for Valencia again. About our team, I believe they need all support from their fans. In Valencia I met a lot of people who were sorry for ETNZ’s defeat, affirming that the team had been unlucky to lose the regatta in that way. Talking about Bertarelli, I am very upset and disappointed ’cause he wants to transformer the AC just in a financial affair, forgetting the real meaning of the competition.
I can imagine the spirit of the team nowadays, but I can tell you that many people also in Europe love and respect ETNZ, and I am sure that our guys are going to get stronger in just a while!
….GO KIWIS!!! ,+
When are they coming home ?
My little contribution to support for ETNZ, I’m poor so I can’t afford any of the kit so the best I’ve got is, staying up all night to watch;
Winning is one thing, learning from losing is better than winning.
We will crush them in the next event.
Hi Tim, you made me cry. Unfortunatly I am not a kiwi, but I feel that my spirit is so similar to yours. I have just come back from Valencia where I heard that some of the team are going to leave for NZ tomorrow, but it depends on the other regattas some of them are taking part to nowadays..
your video is so emotional…great!
I think that your contribution is very important to support our guys, ’cause it ‘s the real difference from the other syndacates in the AC…THE REAL KIWI SPIRIT OF PASSION AND LOVE FOR SAILING!
Hi Tim! Really nice movie!
Cheers
Giulio
PS
But Giovanni Belgrano is Italian.
Italian-born, Giovanni Belgrano studied in the UK researching composite materials and structures. In 1983 he joined an Isle Of Wight company SP Systems and was soon developing new structures and better materials, and over the past 20 years has worked with many top yacht-racing projects, including Il Moro, Prada 2000, Stealth and Kingfisher.
Hi Giulio…yes, Giovanni Belgrano is Italian….it’s nice to know an italian in ETNZ!
hehe I took them all from the ETNZ website, so if they made a mistake so did I
No problem Tim..
And did you know YOU were one of the main sponsors of Luna Rossa???
Have a look at LR’s main sail…
http://www.lunarossafanclub.it/wp-content/themes/lrfc/images/lunarossa_md.gif
Having never stepped on a boat in my life, (and probably never will) I guess that’s as close as my (name sake) will get
Awesome work Tim. I’m hoping there’s an appreciation ceremony of some sort for the ETNZ boys in both Auckland and Wellington. I sincerely can’t wait to show my support and of course catch a glimpse of the Louis Vuitton Cup (the last time it will be under THAT name perhaps?)! If anyone hears anything, please post it here. Cheers
You forgot Christchurch (where I am)
Frankly, when it comes to that LVC cup it should stay a permanent resident of the RNZYS, or spend it’s time there until the next AC where it goes back to Bruno Trouble and put in his locker, either way Rolex should build there own.
Don’t know how Bruno feels about it but I’d feel insulted.
it could be nice to see ETNZ in Nz…I hope to meet them in Auckland!
Sorry Tim…an Christchurch too!
And total agreement about the Cup (or we keep it haha).
I can’t believe some of the crap that is spewing out of Butterworth’s mouth. You’d think he was bitter about not winning the Cup or something? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/main.jhtml?xml=/sport/2007/07/10/sosail110.xml
an=and
I can’t believe it!!!!! The are no words to comment Butterworth’s behaviour
…just ignore that!
There are rumors floating around the Russell & Brad want to return to New Zealand, well boys if you want to come back without being harassed by every New Zealander calling you traitors and generally thinking ill of you, every time you enter a bar or supermarket in New Zealand, singing these songs isn’t going to make us turn on our radios if you know what I mean.
However Russell rumored to have given TNZ first refusal for the next America’s Cup, goes a little way to repairing the damage.
You know what saddens me more, I wish we’d never won in 95′ then we wouldn’t have to lament this torture.
I also wish people would stop calling the Alinghi New Zealanders KIWI’s, there New Zealanders that’s where it ends, the term KIWI for me is a term of endearment at least that’s what calling someone a KIWI means to me.
btw: I’m British born, I’ve lived in New Zealand since 1991 am I torn between Orgin and ETNZ? no ETNZ all the way.
I quickly got over it when Russell and Brad took their mates over to Alinghi. I thought that it was probably just money and capitalism at work. But I certainly wouldn’t want them back. Russell maybe, as long as the members current team aren’t asked to stand aside. I’ve heard Ray Davies might not be available next time around if everything is happening in 2009, and perhaps Russell could step into his role. But the rest of the Alinghi NZers, no way. Dean and many of the others picked themselves up after the disaster of 2003 and have worked their asses off, and I don’t think it would be right to have them move aside for any of the Alinghi NZers.
I’ve been wondering more about Chris Dickson than anyone else lately. By resigning from BMWO, is he saying that he doesn’t want to be part of that team now? He’s been getting calls, so he says.
Chris Dickson on ETNZ b-boat? sure. a-boat I don’t think so, Dean has worked far to hard to be tossed aside.
That is one of the things I’ve wrestled with after hearing the rumor, about Russell and I came to the conclusion that it would be unfair to dismiss Dean for Russell, Dean deserves his spot and I can’t really find much fault in the guy, which brings me to the point where I think there could be improvement, Terry did a wonderful job getting too the AC but looking at some of the choices he made where shocking, I wouldn’t mind him coming back on the premise that he has learned not to make those shocking tactical errors again, however ETNZ knows where they failed worst and if they could replace Terry with Russell then I could only see that as being positive.
Wouldn’t that be the sight
Shane yes I got over it, but I can’t help thinking every time Alinghi wins that AC with the ‘tight’ 5 on board that should have been us, in Auckland.
Interesting comments from Butterworth, not sure why he has to keep harping on about it.I reckon he’s still reeling over the fact that the racing was as close as it turned out to be. He wasn’t expecting to be put under any pressure from Dean and the boys. He had said only a few days before race one “SUI 100 is half a generation ahead of NZL 92″ pretty close for half a generation!!
On the subject of the new class of boat. If it remains one new boat per team, I see it working in the challengers favour. Most teams will be pretty keen to 2 boat test with each other and more than likely not with Alinghi. If (BMW?) Oracle again base themselves in Auckland thay could get in alot of testing with (E?)TNZ before heading to europe for whenever & wherever the cup is.
The idea of Alinghi taking part in the Challengers Series is laughable, are any of the teams going to push themselves and their equipment against a boat that isn’t scoring points? why risk it?
I absolutely agree with Tim about Russel and Bread, even though I prefer the first one to the second, He seems to be quite better than Butterworth as man…
Anyway, I hope ETNZ will be the same team as now…I know that someone made some mistakes, but we have to consider the lack of experience caused by the younger age. So, I would like to see the same team, especially Dean ’cause I know he worked so hard and I wish him all the best in his career. About Chris Dickson, as I said before, I like him very much and I am very sorry for him…I think he is a very good sailor!!!
“The idea of Alinghi taking part in the Challengers Series is laughable, are any of the teams going to push themselves and their equipment against a boat that isn’t scoring points? why risk it?”
This is laughable, if it was me and I didn’t lose any points but not racing them?!? I’d simply go to the start line as if I’m going to race them, hype them up to the max that I’m going to blow there doors off, and just as the start gun goes, go around the pin / comity boat, and head home.
Leaving Alinghi to sail by there lone-sum, now if you could get all the challengers to do that
You guys might be forgetting something. What if they (we) have to race Alinghi to gain valuable points for the Rolex (?) finals. Remember how the bonus points that ETNZ gained through the Acts were so valuable in the Louis Vuitton finals? Ultimately Alinghi holds all the cards again. They didn’t (obviously) like how close the racing was this time and hence decided to create a new class of boat – with few concrete details to go on yet – they’ve effectively got a head start on ALL the teams and if you believe the rumours, this is what Russell wanted 4 years ago but Ernie wanted to save money instead, so now he’s paying the price, but don’t discount that these guys have already done the research and have a design ready before the rules are fully released.
I still think there’s a huge hole out there for another series which features just the 101 (or so) ACC 5 boats. Some sort of “historic” racing would be awesome and could eventually over-shadow the AC. Of course I’m just dreaming, but wouldn’t that be marvelous?
BTW, I think way too many people in the press are being hard on Terry. He got the calls absolutely correct in the LV Finals. Obviously the conditions were just a bit different for the AC and unless you’re on the boat you can’t really be critical of how the cards fell in the AC. He’ll learn from this (as will all of ETNZ). Calling for someone to be sacked or whatever does not help. IMHO.
Looks like Francesco is leaving LR after all
http://www.cupineurope.com/NewsEN/2007/LunaRossa.htm
Hey Julian
I agree with you. The media have been too tough on him
Hi mates.
) it happened. And they were always anticipating the next move.
I think Dean and Ed both did a very good job.
Do you think that the big difference in the AC final was the tactician? (Terry vs BB)?
Against us (LR) Terry was perfect.
And even Alinghi’s afterguard took some risk and made some errors here and there. (Some say because they were too much confident in their boat’s speed at the beginning).
But when they gave TNZ the penalty in race 7 they made a really smart move (who do you think decided that move? Brad, Ed or both?)
Couldn’t we expect such a move?
The only thing I can’t really understand was why we did the penalty so far from the finish line!!
That was crucial. But I must admit that sitting in front of a computer with the virtual .. make me a very smart sailor…
Following the regatta on the Italian TV we had Paul Cayard and Francesco De Angelis commenting. They were absolutely brilliant. They explained everything just a fraction of second after (and often before
Giulio
PS
We are very sorry for Francesco leaving our team!
He is part of Lusa Rossa’s history.
May be this was necessary.
Now we are waiting to know the future of our beautiful Red Moon.
Francesco, you will always be a friend.
I hope he will find a competitive team to continue his quest for the America’s Cup.
I agree Giulio. It is very sad to see Francesco go. I got to see him when he was invited to Parliament back when LR lost in the AC2000 against TNZ. I think he even got voted sexiest man in the Country back then hahaha. LR were gracious in defeat and we opened our Country up for them! Those were good days, back when the Challenger and the Defender had much respect for each other. Those days are gone now. Sad to say.
Now hopefully TVNZ can sign up Coutts for commentary next time around – we never lost a race when he was doing the commentary! Haha
Of course, I’m kidding…
Guys, I am very sorry for Francesco De Angelis…but I absolutely disagree with the article about his behaviour…and people who followed Ac on Italian Tv can’t deny it!
Talking about ETNZ as I told you I don’t think the problem was just the tactitian, but, as all experts affirm, was the lack of experience…
China Team, United Germany and +39 lacked experience… not ETNZ
Some of these people are playng in the AC game for more than 10 years now… and they are among the best sailors in the world. I wouldn’t say they suffered lack of experience at all.
They did a fantastic job in this AC and they won the LVC beeing the best challenger.
Sadly the “Swiss” were slightly better in crucial decisions and with (may be thanks to) a slightly faster boat. That’s it.
This is sport.
? For what concerns De Angelis I don’t understand what is the behaviour you are talking about Vale.
Bye
Giulio
Ciao a tutti
Yes, it’s sad to see Francesco leave LR – I saw an interview with him on Sky Sports, he certainly lived up to all the talk of him being a nice guy, it was a great interview.
is there much talk of LR continuing? Seems those rumours of Jimmy Spithill going to Alinghi are knocking around again. I know he had said “only if I can take my guys” to them before. May he wants to go on his own now?
you have to consider also the age Giulio! You can’t deny Bread has got more experience than Terry….It means that a person especially a tactician who has to be ready to every change gains from experience.
I think that ETNZ’s crew is the best in the world, but they are humans and mistakes are normal…
About De Angelis, I know we have different points of view, and that you are a strong fan..probably also a friend of Francesco, but I saw a lack of professional behaviour on Tv, probably it’s his way and I can’t criticize it…but that’s my way and I don’t like him very much.
I think the “Swiss” Bertarelli will do everything money can do to bring James Spithill to Alinghi…
I know it’s a dream, but who knows?. The other members of the crew should be confirmed, they always did a fantastic job.
Given FDA is leaving the team and James could.. (probably Grael will leave too) it’s not a good situation for Luna Rossa. The only hope to remain competitive could be: Coutts skipper and helmsman and Cayard tactician…
I never met Francesco. Unfortunately.
I don’t know what do you mean with “lack of professional behaviour”.
A person without great professional skills couldn’t do a fraction of what he has done in his long career. Before the AC experience, he was five times World Champion in different classes. He is considered (also RC said it) one of the best guy in fine tuning a race boat bringing it to its maximum speed and development.
He was the first (and the only) not English speaking helmsman capable of winning the LVC and competing for the AC. And most notably he always earned the respect of everyone who raced against or with him for his sportmanship and charisma.
He has been skipper, helmsman and leader of the Prada Challenge (now called Luna Rossa Challenge), not a minor team… in 2000 and 2003, skipper and leader in 2007, a position that recently gave more than a trouble to Chris Dickson in Oracle…
Ok Vale, maybe you don’t like him very much, and I respect your ideas, but saying he is not professional…
I’m proud he is Italian.
Giulio, I was not talking about his skills in sailing….I talked about just his way towards the others. I have to say that probably I am not very objective in this matter, but I can tell you that according to my way I don’t believe him a professional person. For example, I can notice his behaviour after LN’s defeat against NZ….I don’t like people able to talk just in case of victory!!! Giulio, I know that we have opposite points of view and that could be quite impossible to understand my way, but according to me a professional behaviour is made not just by winning races, but above all by a strong respect towards the others…not just in case of victory!!!
But…have we watched the same TV???
Unfortunately I couldn’t see all the races on tv…
But I followed allmost all our races in both the 2000 and 2003 AC and we didn’t win at the time… so I judge also from the past.
In the interviews and in the comments I heard this year I didn’t notice anything particularly unprofessional or unpleasant in his mood.
If you mention the fact that he tryed to justify the team after the defeat maybe you’re right, but that has anything to do with being professional or not.
To say the truth I’ve found much more unpleasant some comments from the Italian press and even from Vasco Vascotto (of ML) speaking about LR.
But of course I’m not m not particularly objective too anyway… since I’m a LR’s fan
yes..I think that it is normal to have different points of views, ’cause we follow our feelings and not just our mind!!!
So….It’s ok!!!
I agree!
Sorry to disagree, vale but all the interviews I have seen of Francesco have always been “Professional”. He is a very personable guy which is a huge plus in my book. There’s enough “snobs” in sport and he is not one. And he’s always been gracious in defeat. They were a strong team this time, let’s hope they can rebuild to a stronger team next time around.
No problem, Julian…It seems to me i have watched a different TV….probably from another planet!!!!
But…. I keep on thinking what I said…..!!!!
Hi mates,
from http://www.sailinganarchy.com :
“Attack of The Larry
A birdie told us that today Larry Ellison has filed to be the Challenger of Record for the next event in Switzerland. We hear that he is also suing Alinghi for not following the deed of gift, re: the challenging club where a yacht club has certain requirements to be legit, i.e. minimum number of members, standing with the national authority etc., etc. The post AC fireworks are better than the race!”
It this rumor turns out to be true… a lot of things could change.
“It this rumor turns out to be true… a lot of things could change.”
Like what exactally?
Is the Deed Of Gift a legal document ?
Of course it is.
http://www.a3.org/ac2000_DeedofGift.html
The Auld Mug was donated by its owner to the NYC with this legal document 150 years ago. And I think it is still the New York state supreme court that holds jurisdiction over the Deed.
The defender and his challenger of record can change some of the the rules regarding the races if they find an agreement. If they don’t, the deed of gift itself returns to be the only valid rule for the America’s Cup. Do you remember the NZ big boat vs the US catamaran back in 1988?
Here is an extract:
…
…
This Cup is donated upon the conditions that it shall be preserved as a perpetual Challenge Cup for friendly competition between foreign countries.
Any organized Yacht Club of a foreign country, incorporated, patented, or licensed by the legislature, admiralty, or other executive department, having for its annual regatta on ocean water course on the sea, or on an arm of the sea, or one which combines both, shall always be entitled to the right of sailing a match for this Cup, with a yacht or vessel propelled by sails only and constructed in the country to which the Challenging Club belongs, against any one yacht or vessel constructed in the country of the Club holding the Cup.
…
…
The Club challenging for the Cup and the Club holding the same may, by mutual consent, make any arrangement satisfactory to both as to the dates, courses, number of trials, rules and sailing regulations, and any and all other conditions of the match, in which case also the ten months’ notice may be waived.
…
…
In case the parties cannot mutually agree upon the terms of a match, then three races shall be sailed, and the winner of two of such races shall be entitled to the Cup. All such races shall be on ocean courses, free from headlands, as follows:
…
Very interesting, Giulio! I also thought it was strange that Alinghi can change the boat specifications without any input from the Challengers. Last time they sort input from all sorts of nautical experts from around the world, so why wouldn’t Alinghi do the same with the 90-foot iteration? Of course I’m reminded of a quote that Dennis Connor said, which goes something like… Why would you change the design rules, unless you want to cheat?
So does Larry have a iron clad case ? ( you wouldn’t want to walk into this and come out with egg on your face ).
Alinghi can make all the changes they want only if they find a CoR like Desafio, who signed a blank document… If the Spanish will not be considered a legally valid CoR everything must be rediscussed.
Let’s hope this thig bring some advantege to the challengers (or less to the defender)…
But some of the innovation Alinghi proposed aren’t bad, I think.
typo..
It was
..this thing brings some advantage..
Why would Desafio not be a considered a legal CoR?
And if there not considered legal, what was they doing racing with the challengers in the 32nd AC?
Thank you Giulio!!! You are our dictionary!!! I hope that something could change in better for challengers…
I think that Alinghi has too many advantages….. Bertarelli decides everything, and it’s no right!
I can try to give my explanation, but I’m not 100% sure. Hey PETER tell us something!!!
If I’ve correctly understood…
It’s a completely different matter being the CoR or a normal challenger.
The CoR is the Yacht Club who challenges the Yacht Club who owns the Cup.
They both MUST follow the Deed of Gift.
After, and if they agree, they can establish the rule of the game, and EVEN accept that other challengers/defenders take part to the competion with the limitation they want.
According to the Deed of Gift, the challenging Yacht Club HAVE TO BE:
an “organized Yacht Club of a foreign country, incorporated, patented, or licensed by the legislature, admiralty, or other executive department, having for its annual regatta on ocean water course on the sea, or on an arm of the sea, or one which combines both” etc…
Now, behind Desafio in this AC there was the Real Federación Española de Vela, I think it’s the Spanish sailing federation, not a Yacht Club.
To became CoR they created a brand new Yacht Club in June this year…
I repeat, this only is what I understood and it could be wrong…
No Giulio, It’s clear!!! After NZ’s defeat I saw on TV that desafio signed as record challenger of Alinghi and that it had changed its nature in Yacht Club to represent Spain…is it right?
Yes that would be correct, those with accounts at “Daily Sail” should check there now as the news has started to his the main stream media, rather than on the backwaters of rumor and speculation, it would seam.
http://www.thedailysail.com/
STOP PRESS: BMW Oracle Racing via the Golden Gate YC have delivered a fresh challenge to Alinghi for the 33rd America’s Cup, claiming Spain’s to be invalid!
(What would we do without the internet ? .. LOL)
Tim,
Here’s more about it on ybw….
http://www.ybw.com/auto/newsdesk/20070612104917ywamericascup07.html
late edit – here’s the letter from the GGYC
http://www.ggyc.com/GGYCChallenge.pdf
Take that Berty germ
How do you like them apples Berty!
lol
I’m with Larry this time.
And I look forward to see what is going to happen now…
PS Look at the dimensions of the boat “USA” of the challenge from the GGYC
Berty brings the dog, Larry brings the CAT! wait a second haven’t we heard this before?
eh eh eh eh, and it’s a big CAT indeed.
Guess we’ll have to upgrade it too, Lion
Is it more likely to be a trimaran or a (squared??) catamaran?
(confused look) there are other boats other than an ACC class?? just kidding, but it’s the only one I follow
I follow every class… more precisely I follow “in” every class, couse I’m very slow..
The official AC’s site doesn’t even mention the fact…
Why not? eh eh eh
Let’s se the lawyers racing now. Very good the prestart of LE coming from the right…
The Umpire Strikes Back
Do you think there is something strange behind that?……To be honest, I have still doubts also about the end of the last AC!
I think the fight on the water was fair and both teams did well, the swiss just a little better.
I’m stll convinced that their boat was faster.
Sadly.
But a win in race 7 could have changed everything
Giulio, you look like an expert..so, I ask you for a question I would like to answer….could you tell me how is possible to say that Alinghi won for just a second? are there something like cameras to establish that without doubts?
I saw a photo (from the helycopter I think) and it shows that Alinghi was ahead just before the finish line, but I don’t know if they have some electronic device or photo finish. I think they should.
http://www2.worldpub.net/images/sw/124-FBAlinghiVictory275.jpg
1 second… it was just bad luck…
Back in 1992 in San Diego, our boat, il Moro di Venezia with Paul Cayard at the helm, won by only 3 seconds a race against America3 in the AC final…
PS
I’m not all that expert, I’m just a Luna Rossa’s fan
Hi guys, I see some lawyers getting rich out of this, it looks like an application of the golden rule” he who has the gold, makes the rules.”
For this event to go forward and prosper there needs to be transparency in the design rules and the challenge formats. If the race is one sided any audience will not follow what is happening.
I was hoping the rule would be changed to a more accessible boat like 70 feet and able to surf uphill, something like a longer TP52, which I’m sure a lot of the sailors and audiences would enjoy more. By making the boats larger the expense increases exponentially.
Giulio – I agree. I was just watching the Acts and there was also a race in there where the finish between two boats was just 2 seconds. A photo-finish should be mandatory. I thought it was also strange that the woman on the committee boat had only the blue flag in her hand. If you go here and click on the link “Yes, Alinghi did win the final race” there’s a good analysis here: http://www.sail-world.com/index_n.cfm?SEid=362&RequestTimeOut=180
Hi Lee! How are you?
I agree with your ideas. But the AC has always been like this.. it is not only a sport event, and obviously not a sport where everybody can compete.
It’s a game where the winner decide the rules… so that winning is always incredibly difficult. It’s not a fair competition.
Maybe this is the reason of its success.
Maybe Berty should reinstate the rule that requires the Challengers actually sail their boats from their home port to the place of Challenge? That meant the Americans held onto the Cup for so long. Mind you, that probably wouldn’t help his cause. HAHA
Eh eh eh eh, and I’d like to see EB sailing with Alinghi from the Geneva Lake to the Mediterranean See..
In their response Thursday, Club Nautico Espanol de Vela pointed out that with regard to the obligation to hold a regatta in open waters, they have several regattas in preparation to take place in September and that the Deed of Gift does not mention when such events must take place – before or after acceptance of a challenge. This looks like lawyer territory.
Further CNEV claim that with regards to the date and venue of the next event, this is nothing to do with them and they are in the same position as the other potential competitors and that this was the situation for the last challenge.
They then finish with a general statement that their negotiations with the defender had been designed to achieve a fair and open competition for all participants.
No response has been made to date by Team Alinghi or the Societe Nautique Geneve.
Doesn’t matter “holding” an “annual” regatta before or after the fact is neither here not there, considering they have not held one at all which invalid dates them as a CoR on the basis, making BMWO the only valid one.
For DE to escape that they would have had to of held a regatta between the time they signed the CoR and BMWO challenge to escape that, which they have not.
It doesn’t matter if they “plan” to hold on in the future or not, the time they will likely focus on is between the signing of CoR with DE, and BMWO challenge.
The end result should EB try playing like a spoiled punk brat? and not accept BMWO’s challenge that’s fine we’ll be seeing in 10 months time, Larry walking off with the prized tea pot, and I hope the camera men don’t forget the close ups on EB faces as it breaks down into tears
I wonder, what the tight 5 now think ? maybe there wishing they hadn’t sign EB tea pot party now, and wished they’d follow Coutts over to Larry.
Hi Lee..you’re absolutely right! Gold makes rules! Giulio, do you agree with AC’rules about organization, or do you think something should be changed to favourite skills than money?
Greetings to our Italiano amici.
MMM I don’t want to seem cynical but what I saw with the manipulation of the cup by ACM/berty predicts a one sided contest. On the other hand with enough input from all clubs concerned it may turn around into something a bit more equal where it is the sailors that make the difference. Lets all hope that sanity prevails and the contest stays open. I really don’t care who the winner is, as long as every one gets a crack at it.
Currently it is a one sided contest, Alinghi win I don’t know why anyone would contest under these current conditions, only the brave and heroic would even entertain the idea.
Change does need to come to the America’s Cup, but this sort of radical thinking is not it.
Maybe it’s time to take the defender out of the loop so too speak, leaving it’s soul purpose to defend the cup, every other rule must be agreed on by those that challenge, hence forth while we might see a boat type change, the rest of the protocol wouldn’t exist if everyone had to agree too that.
If this does get reversed, and BMWO at least in my opinion does get set as CoR I wonder how many will be racing to Alinghi’s aid when they want to do there in house testing, or should that be “outhouse” testing
Hi Lee,
Good to see you back here – I agree with you, Vincenzo Oronato (ML) was pretty outspoken about how powerless the Challenger Commission was in the run up to AC32 – I wonder how he feels now!
Wise words mate Lee!!!
I can’t believe that there is nothing to do against Bertarelli and all his power….Everybody knows, but nobody does something to change the situation…
Lee and all kiwi friends, Lesson N.1: “amici italiani” (instead of “amici italiano”).
“I can’t believe that there is nothing to do against Bertarelli and all his power….Everybody knows, but nobody does something to change the situation…”
I would but… that’s ILLEGAL!
TIM…are you a parrot???????
Yes……I understand you…but I don’t give up thinking there could be something legal to do to change the situation…. I am studying to find the solution…..
Guys….have you visited my site…it’s to honour NZ!!!!!
http://www.mynewzealand.splinder.com
Vale, that’s just a way for someone to “quote” some and reply to it so that people know what your referring too, other wise my comment would look really odd.
As to your site, either that’s the wrong link or something, I only speak English
Tim…It was just a joke about you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
what about my site? I write in english there…
do you mean the instructions in Italian?
Ciao Vale,
It asks for a username & password – can you not make your page public?
Ciao Gary!!!!
Sorry …..I am going to make it public now!!!!!
Thank you Gary!!!!
Ok….It’s open!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Guys…last news: Luis Vitton won’t be the AC’s sponsor anymore! The last competions’ changes made that decision by LV who affirmed that the AC has become too commercial.
I AM VERY UPSET…AND YOU CAN IMAGINE WHY, AND, ABOVE ALL , YOU CAN IMAGINE WHO I AM FURIOUS WITH!!!!!!!
Good news for you folk perhaps? http://www.sail-world.com/news_printerfriendly.cfm?Nid=35667
Now who are you blaming ? ETNZ for losing or Alinghi for winning ?
I said it before the 32nd AC started, someone anyone “HAS” to get that cup off of that megalomaniac before he does this fine sport a death blow.
You see EB wants to turn this event into a “world football cup” or “world rugby cup”, lets hope Larry can sock it too them in the worst way, maybe even with a sail off and take EB tea pot away, and restore honor and order to the event.
Just imagine how LV must feel, after years and years of loyal service only to end up like this!
LOL… http://bp2.blogger.com/_1CDZ7Ya8Ni0/RpasAMtacOI/AAAAAAAAAhw/-EdbxxXOqMI/s1600-h/spainawsers.jpg
I like the idea that LV could still run their own sailing event and that they own the rights to the Cup itself.
Vale, yes I realised after I had posted that the order was the other way. For me as I said before I only know piccolo numero Italian words.
It looks like Berty is angling for the best deal for him. It seems odd when he is so wealthy anyway, but I guess good commercial practice. So he is going to get two venues to outbid each other, then his personal expense will be minimal.
Julian your idea may have more merit than you think, it looks like there are a dozen or so syndicates that are annoyed at what is going on. It is bad for the sport to not be able to progress in the design or location sense. Only Larry has the means to be able to dispute that.
I had wished that Grant Dalton had filed this, considering if they ‘had’ to sail it on the water and we’d won, it would be back in New Zealand.
But I rethought it a bit, better for our boys to concentrate on that which matters most, improving there skills, and sailing than getting into this clown show.
Lee, I was joking about your Italian!!!!
Guys….I can’t stand it anymore! I would like to do something to change all that. WHAT A SHAME!!!!! I think that all seriuos syndacates should consider to not take part in the next cup if things don’t change, ’cause it has become just a commercial object.
I think that it could be just a waste of money and I suggest to menace to not take part in it!!!!!!!
Talking about Italy as a place for the next cup…you can imagine what i think about it!!!!!!!!
I’m tryng to post a (maybe too long) message withou success
I give up
NO way to post my considerations about the Cup in Italy!
Hey Peter or Paul, can you see what has happened to my message??
Cheers Giulio
I Try to split the message in parts…
PART – 1
Hi guys,
I see the discussion here grows!
Very good! It seems like the Cup is not finished yet.
I think that it is good for the AC to give the defender an advantage.
) makes it even
It has always be like this and the fact that the Auld Mug is so difficult to win (almost impossible.. do you remember?
more fascinating, much more than any other sailing trophy.
BUT EB and Alinghi have gone too far away in this direction.
I absolutely agree with you.
For what concerns the Cup in Italy I have some considerations:
First of all I must say I think this is only a smart move from Alinghi to add pressure to the Spanish authorities in Valencia…
Grrrr
Blocked again after PArt -1 …
Giulo, I think that Sardinia is a good sailing location for wind just after summer?
You would know better. I think Berty is just playing one against the other to make the most money? Valencia seems ok and from people that have sailed there they think it is even better around now.
Vale, its ok and I would like to learn more Italian.
Now heres an idea….Currently we have the Louis Vuitton cup and have a good relationship with them, how about a Louis Vuitton series in Auckland and leave Bertie to play by himself?
If you want to know my thoughts I wil lsend you an email…
Ok you have my address yes?
In that part of Sardinia there is a lot of wind in every season of the year,
I can assure you. It could be the best place in Italy for the wind.
The place is near the most famous Italian sailing school, il Centro Velico Caprera.
And the “Bocce di Bonifacio”, between Sardegna (let’s use the right Italian name!!) and Corsica are famous for strong wind ans sea! Not a quiet place where to sail!
Done
PS
it was “Bocche di Bonifacio” not “Bocce”
Grazie.
Look what I would like to see is a regatta with fleet and match racing where it goes through to a final, like any other match race on the planet.
It wouldnt even be hard to do it every year, especially if the sponsorship and television rights were opened up to more people.
It is hard to say anything and not sound like a sore loser but I think you guys that have read what I write know that I love the sport and the game and want to see it played out.
Giulio, I fully appreciate how you want to see the Cup in Italy, won by an Italian team. I think that both Mascalzone and Luna Rossa have got the talent to do it.
In fact that Mascalzone boat looked faster than our boat to me, there was something a little smoother about the way it moved in the water. Remeber that both the Italian teams i have mentioned didnt really have much time in their program to fully develop their boats. I think both teams will come back hungry to win. Good Luck!!.
But if that location is the best place to sail the races then let us sail there, remeber that Bertty would have a little bit of trouble trying to sail in an arm of the sea in Geneva.
I like this blog for this very reason.
There are plenty of people who love this sport and want to discuss about it in a soft manner.
I lurked other blogs and forum in English, finding them informative but often unpleasant for the tone used in the discussions.
Being here during the Cup was like going to the pub and discuss with friends.
Thanks again Peter
PS
The Luna Rossa Fan Club forum is very good too, but it’s in Italian…
Hey Lee, it seems you are getting better and better with your Italian, isn’t it?
In the area we are talking about, the northern Sardina, every year The YCCS ( Yacht Club Costa Smeralda, who challenged for the AC with Azzura in the eighties) organizes the “Settimana della Bocche” “= Week of the Straits”.
Follow this link for some photos of a past edition…
http://www.yccs.it/ita/stagioni/2003/bocche/foto.php
Do you like the venue for the 33 AC?
Looks pretty cool! Russell and Ernie eh?
Hi guys!!! Giulio, I imagine you’re very happy about Ac in Italy…aren’t you? I am very sad ’cause last news seem to confirm my fear about tha fact Ac is nowadays just a commercial thing. It looks like our football, where money are the only things able to control the whole system…
What is your prediction about that? Do you think that Sardegna will be the place for the next Ac?
Ciao Ciao!
Vale
First and foremost BE & LE have to come to terms on the whole DE as CoR debacle, if no terms can be a agreed upon then it’s off to the water, “should” LE win on the water he will then become the defender of said tea pot, and it’ll be back in America.
Now of course I’d rather it be New Zealand, but I’d rather it be anywhere than BE grubby little adolescent bratty hands.
Really we should not be blaming the tight 5, no we should be blaming BE he is the scum of the earth that is deserving of all our vile hatred and loathing, then maybe the tight 5
oops BE=EB
Tim, if you were the best in the world at what you do would you, would you choose to not do it as well? I dont know myself, perhaps the way that some kiwis have treated them makes them feel like stuff you too. I dont know.
I saw a team that was beatable and we didnt. Yes it hurt but we can take the lessons from that forward. There are other chances and I think that the kiwis in Alinghi will be in EB’s ear about keeping it fair.
Yes thanks Giulio, I only learned a little and I have a chance to practice here haha. Hey that Sardegna looks like a great sailing venue.
have a good week team
Lee
Hi,
of course I want to see the Cup in Italy, but only if it’s brought here by an Italian team after winning it..
Anyway, I think northern Sardinia could be one of the best venues in Europe.
Much better than Valencia for the wind I think, but not for the infrastructures.
PS
I don’t want to defend EB, I don’t like his view of the event and the fact that he wants to make every decision alone..
But while Prada, Oracle, Emirates, ecc.. are commercial brands…
Alinghi is not…
I think the EB’s business is the Cup itself.
And don’t forget the America’s Cup started to be a commercial thing thanks to Sir Thomas Lipton
All syndacates need a commercial brand as sponsor..it’s normal…but there must be some limits to avoid that a competition as Ac become just for the rich in the world, not taking in count the skills and the passion of people who dedicate their life working hard to win. I know, probably I am too emotional, I should be more rational, but I believe that too many things in our would keep on to be ruined by money and power…forgetting feelings.
Yesterday I read that Bertarelli asked Valencia for 200 million of euros…it’s too much! As Spanish people affirmed in Valenzia, “ES UNA BARBARIDAD!”
According to me Valencia has made a good job in the 32nd AC, and It would a great thing to let it organize the next competition…
Lee – “Tim, if you were the best in the world at what you do would you, would you choose to not do it as well? I dont know myself, perhaps the way that some kiwis have treated them makes them feel like stuff you too. I dont know.”
It wouldn’t matter too me, how good I was my country is whom I owe allegiance, and certainly when that country has paid for the position I obtained, lets say for argument that it was me, I’d have told EB to go shove his millions in 2000, and defended in 2003, 2007 as well, money is not everything in life what good is money when you need your country to help you out, out of the kindness of there honorable heart? a quote “Your money can’t save you anymore than it can me!” – titanic.
“ES UNA BARBARIDAD!”?? what is that in English ?
Tim,”Es una Barbaridad” in English means “It’s a terrible thing, out of real life in a negative way, totally unacceptable”.
Thanks Vale.
You’re welcome Tim!!!!
I agree with you but we must be honest and we can’t forget that:
- The America’s Cup is not, and has nothing to do with the Olympics.
- It has never been a fair competition between two or more opponents (why the Americans could keep the Cup for over a century?…) often involving lawyers and courts..
- It has always been a competition between what we now call billionairs…
- It is a design and technology competition, and this means money.. again
Valencia and Spain chose (and asked) to host the event for their own interest, not for the sport or any other reason, they weren’t forced at all. They probably tought it was a good occasion of development for the area and the town, and I think they were right.
Now they have the possibility to say Good Bye to Ernesto if they want.
I personally don’t like Ernesto Bertarelli and his team because he and Alinghi were never champions in sportmanship (expecially after winning), not because they changed the spirit of the AC (they didn’t).
Giulio
I agree with you about the AC history, I can’t deny that it was born and has always been a sport for wealthy people, but I don’t agree with your point of view about Alinghi…I think they are changing the spirit in AC!!!!About Valencia, I agree, the Ac has been a good occasion to develop its economy.. but to sum up I think that the situation is going beyond the limits…
Yes Tim, in my heart I agree, but I think the reasons that the kiwi’s went to Alinghi in the first place was, according to them, a reaction to the intractable management structure in TNZ at the time. The management were not being responsive to input from the guys sailing the boats. They didn’t know that 82 was going to break and they were expecting to sail a difficult series against us.
I am not defending what they did, I just see it as a reaction to getting booed, egged and hissed at in 03 and probably a good chance to be set up for life financially.
It is still a long way to go before the next cup and it will be interesting to see who EB has on board for the next one. I dont like all the legal to and fro and the badmouthing. I just want to see some great sailing.
Good piece of commentary here: http://sailjuice.blogspot.com/2007/07/thats-not-challenge-this-is-challenge.html
Lee W: I want to see fair sailing, not one boat 50nm in front of the next one.
yesterday I read that also Fabrizio Bertelli told ernesto bertarelli to hurry up, ’cause he wants to know the location and time for the next AC as soon as possible, at the end of the month. But He affirmed also that it’s not good to do victmism and that everybody has to accept the rules from EB, following the ancient Ac’s tradition which wants the winner deciding everything for the next competition.
But I keep on not agreeing…Talking about The alinghi kiwis, It’s normal that they went there for money reasons, but I don’t like their way, especially for newzealanders whom I believe AND I HOPE still so far from the worse european spirit so material and superficial which is destroying everything nowadays.
Hi Tim, do you really mean 50 nanometers???
What a close race!!
Good to see Deano sailing again – nice race too!!
http://www.bymnews.com/news/newsDetails.php?id=12115
Thank you Gary for the article…So happy to know Deano sailing again! I like him very much!
Giulio Z: lol nautical miles
and nice I wish there was a sight that tracked TNZ and there achievements.
Vale: yes there a national embarasement here too in New Zealand.
Origin out testing:
http://www.rule69blog.com/archive/2007/july/672/
More pics here: http://sailjuice.blogspot.com/2007/07/gbr-75-tunes-up-against-america.html
Phenomenal Spithill wins the Trombini Match Race in Italy for third time, still wearing Prada clothes…
http://www.matchracetrombini.com/news_2.htm
(in English)
I am very happy for Spithill, he’s a nice person, very professional and polite!!! Congratulations! Giulio, if you are interested in it, in September there will be a competition in Fiumicino, Rome. There will take place in it James Spithill, Paolo Cian and many others, also kiwis!!! It will take place around 12 September….
Julian, thanks for the article…wonderful ancient sailing boat!!!
Another interesting article about the controversy here:
http://www.cowes.co.uk/cb/zone?p=story;story_id=2976
Julian : News on this always brings a sly smile to my face
Same here, Tim. I’m hoping the apple-cart gets upset.
Nice to read this article!!!!!!!
Julian, on the subject of Origin, any idea who’s on the crew? Did all the english guys on +39 move over? Is Ben Ainslie joining them also?
Ben Ainslie is unlikely to move to Origin, has been talking to Luna Rossa if you believe rule69 blog, that’s where he has gone.
I suggest to let Alinghi and Bertarelli alone, organizing another competion….it’s impossible to accept all that taking in count that all syndacates work hard to reach their aims..it’s so wrong to give so much decisional power to just one person!!!!
Ciao Vale, I agree.. Let them race against Desafio while all the other syndicates get back into bed with Louis Vuitton! Larry Ellison is exactly the wrong type of guy that Bertarelli needs contesting the validity of all things AC33, as mark chisnell wrote in his blog “I’ll see your 5 lawyers and raise you 10″
Ciao Gary!!! Yes, it could be so nice to see all syndacates racing for a competition leaving alone EB with all his money and material aims!!!!!
I agree, Larry Allison is not an easy guy to talk to…..but He is the right person to change this bad situation….
Hope Larry in his legal documents underlines that when he comes to court to bring the cup with him, because he won’t be leaving with it.
Guys, another good article here. Looks like momentum is gaining. http://www.sail-world.com/news_printerfriendly.cfm?Nid=35777
Really a verry good and informative article!
Let’s hope Larry and his lawyers can stop ACM power.
http://www.bymnews.com/news/newsDetails.php?id=12307
might not need too, if this has any weight then I hope they have more back bone.
Hi guys,
I think the legality of what eberty is proposing needs to be decided in court. Of course remembering that legality is nothing about justice or fairness, its about the application and historic basis of law.
This wont be the first time I’ve supported Oracle haha
Yes but if they drop DE and take Origins challenge instead, what would be the point? the strongest weapon they have is that DE is an invalid challenge.
If Origin did indeed challenge doesn’t that challenge have to come after the thing is won, and not before? or can you say I challenge for the next AC.
But wait a damn minute here, if they knew Alinghi was going to win and challenged them before it was won by them, looks like match fixing.
oh btw:
http://www.sail-world.com/nz/index.cfm??rd…amp;tickercid=0
I think this is the link you’re after, mate: http://www.sail-world.com/news_printerfriendly.cfm?Nid=35795
The whole match-fixing thing has been discussed/alluded to in the press too Tim. I mean they were putting the awards platform together before the boats sailed out.
eehhmmmm the situation seems to become more seriuos than ever…
what do you think, guys, about the larger boats Alinghi wants for the next cup? do you think it will be better or worse, taking in count that it is quite more difficult to sail with a bigger boat and larger crew?????
Vale: Depends.. if Alinghi ‘as have been rumored’ started construction of there new boat just after they won the cup, then I don’t see any other winner other than Alinghi end of story however! if they release that information late when they other challengers start to build there own, Alinghi will be 6 months behind the times and gives a little opportunity to get an edge over them, how will win will come down to who had the best design team, if the AC32 is anything to go by the 2 best design teams where… drum roll please…
Alinghi & Team New Zealand, proof is in the results.
Could we see another match up between these 2 in the next one, sure could cards are on the table that it could be.
I don’t think it’s anything to worry about for TNZ, more bodies on the boat mean more experience to be had, TNZ has always as with anything in NZ been good a team work, due to it’s autocratic nature. (LOL)
I don’t think Deano will have a problem with a larger boat, it’ll just match his other alter-ego “TRIPOD!”.
Oh btw: if there is match fixing in this game, than I will just quit supporting/watching this event.
GUYS…I NEED YOUR HELP. COULD YOU TELL ME WHERE I HAVE TO GO IN AUCKLAND TO TAKE SAILING LESSONS????
THANK YOU.
VALE
Hi Vale, I would say the RNZYS would be a great place to start, being ETNZ’s yacht club
The club racing turnout would be bigger than the one we saw for CNEV’s “annual regatta” at the weekend, LOL
Hi Gary!!! Thank you very much for information!!! I absolutely want to sail in Auckland….so I need to know where to go before I arrive there.
I need to take a huge amount of lessons to learn theory and to practise…and I want to do that from the deepest part of my hearth!
I have ETNZ cap, T-shirt and belt, so….I am ready to go!!!!
Ok, I am joking!!
sorry….I wrote too fast…..
“from the deepest part of my heart!”…otherwise I am going to get burnt!
Alinghi has probably had the design ready for their 90 footer long ago. If you recall, Coutts wanted to move the team to larger boats with bendy keels after they won in 2003 (yes…2003!) in order to keep their design edge ahead. That’s entirely where all the SUI-100 keel rumours came from. Of course in the end, Berty got his way and opted for the cheaper route and in the process dismissed Coutts. I think he (EB) got a shock when the boats were so close this time around. You have to now question how much of Coutt’s design legacy lived on. I reckon they would have seriously investigated his ideas back then but decided to go with the easier option due to costs.
http://www.rule69blog.com/archive/2007/july/680/
Coutts signs with Oracle: http://www.sailkarma.com/2007/07/russell-coutts-signs-with-oracle.html
.. And the dogs of the Southern Hemisphere & Western Hemisphere gather together there braves to stab at the carbon fiber beast.
It is going to be ever so hard to not support both ETNZ and Oracle next time around, next time they won’t be playing for revenge, we’ve had out revenge.
Next time it’s PERSONAL
Die Hard : And America’s Cup FREE! lol
Now the Herald is reporting the spat. http://www.nzherald.co.nz/event/story.cfm?c_id=531&objectid=10452644 Good stuff!
“GUYS…I NEED YOUR HELP. COULD YOU TELL ME WHERE I HAVE TO GO IN AUCKLAND TO TAKE SAILING LESSONS????
THANK YOU.”
Vale – you could try this:
http://www.pennywhiting.com/
The Whiting family are famous in Auckland sailing.
Also!! Who could not forget the chance to sail on NZL40 and NZL41? I’ve got to try this next time I’m up North. http://www.sailnz.co.nz/default.asp?pageId=10&site=sailnz
Those guys also have a full sailing school: http://www.sailnz.co.nz/default.asp?pageId=41&site=school
Sweet!
I wonder if my Virtual Skipper 3,4 & 5 experience counts LOL
Gidday Guys, thank you very much for your kindness and for your information! I am going to consider the schools you’ve suggested..
Cool, mate!
Looks like Team Shosholoza is a Challenger now. Idiots. http://www.americascup.com/en/33rd/news.php
Yes not a very bright move considering, but they are novices and probably don’t understand all this drama, so we should give them the benefit of the doubt.
Yes, but they could wait for a time.
There is the possibility that they will have to challenge Oracle in San Francisco in 2011…
But maybe it was a decision made for their sponsors.
PS
Here is an interesting interview to Paul Cayard.
He talks about the new protocol (before the GGYC’s issue)
I forgot the link…
http://cayardsailing.com/media/paulcayard5jul07_7.mp3
From http://valenciasailing.blogspot.com
Golden Gate Yacht Club (GGYC) filed a lawsuit today against the Société Nautique de Genève (SNG) in the Supreme Court of the State of New York, which has jurisdiction over the America’s Cup Deed of Gift.
The San Francisco club is asking the Court to:
* void the purported challenge of the Club Náutico Español de Vela (CNEV) because CNEV does not qualify under the Deed of Gift as a challenger;
* declare the “Protocol Governing the 33rd America’s Cup” agreed between SNG and CNEV null and void because (i) CNEV was an invalid challenger, and (ii) SNG is engaging in self-dealing by accepting CNEV’s purported challenge and entering into a protocol which eliminates Challenger rights and omits basic information regarding match rules and conditions.
* declare that GGYC’s challenge filed on 11 July 2007 for the 33rd America’s Cup is valid; and
* require SNG to accept GGYC’s challenge, and implement the terms of the Deed of Gift by participating with GGYC in the establishment of a proper protocol through a consensual process; or, failing that, to proceed with a match with GGYC under the rules expressly set forth in the Deed of Gift.
Have a look at the GGYC site…
They have published all the documents…
http://www.ggyc.com/
It would appear from the documents that SNG (Alinghi) basically too all intent and purpose just flat out ignored GGYC, why? if I was faced with a law suit like that I’d get on the phone or something, at the very least make a public statement backing myself up.
To there determent be it, but there silents only damns them further.
Ciao Guilio, thanks for posting the updates – excellent news
A picture from CNEV regatta…*LOL* http://www.sail-world.com/photos/Med_070717_05_02.jpg
Good commentary: http://stuartalexander.wordpress.com/2007/07/21/16/
Guys, I have had some problems to log in this site…what a terrible sensation..I thought it had been closed!!!!
Thank you for all the articles and pictures about sailing..I hope to be not too old to start sailing
Anyway, I hope to know the next’s cup location, date and syndacates in short time…
Could you tell me something about ETNZ? their site is not updated…where are the guys nowadays???and what about the next cup???
I think I heard Dalts was going to be in Auckland this week. Don’t know about the rest of the team…
Some comment about ETNZ in here: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/event/story.cfm?c_id=531&objectid=10453018&pnum=0
Pyewacket wins the Barn Door for the Tranpac but no record…
Dean Barker, New Zealand’s America’s Cup helmsman, sailed on Pyewacket as a change of pace from the intensity of match racing, although the light-wind part mirrored what he experienced at Valencia last month.
“It was a good opportunity to do some ocean racing,” he said. “It’s different to sail a canting keel boat.”
http://www.transpacificyc.org/
it seems alinghi has closed the deal with valencia
to be announced on wednesday
110 millions €
preregattas june, july 2008…
rolex cup and AC 2009
http://www.lasprovincias.es/valencia/prensa/20070723/cvalenciana/copa-america-queda-valencia_20070723.html
LOL the arrogant little … they have to get out of the court room first.
Good to see the Challenger Commission site being updated again:
http://challengercommission.com/
i wonder if the tight-five knew beforehand what a powermonger berts would turn out to be. snicker…
Thank you for information about ETNZ, Julian!
About Valencia as the next cup’s location…I would be very happy if it is chosen again, ’cause it has done a good job….to sum up, it’s the right place for AC!!!!!
Oracle Media Conference tomorrow! http://www.sail-world.com/news_printerfriendly.cfm?Nid=35941
I just picked this book up. Good to have something to remember the racing by! http://www.randomhouse.co.nz/newsroom/PRESS_RELEASES/Valenzia.pdf
Guys…look at this article..last news from Valencia
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/event/story.cfm?c_id=531&objectid=10453675
Coutts is the BMW Oracle’s new skipper
Here’s an audio clip of the full press conference, just click on the green play button to listen to it
http://valenciasailing.blogspot.com/
hey team,
wow 20m and they havn’t even been accepted to race. Will be interesting to see who else is sailing for Sanfran.
Indeed Lee, so I guess the 8 challengers that are opposed to the new protocol are ETNZ, LR, ML, UITG, CT, Areva, Victory & BMWO?
So Valencia ain’t the venue yet! And ACM dismisses Oracle’s Challenge. What happens next?
I guess we’ll find out something tomorrow…
From: webmaster@americascup.com [mailto:webmaster@americascup.com]
Sent: 24 July 2007 19:04
To: Cantwell, Gary
Subject: Live America’s Cup Press Conference on Wednesday
On Wednesday at 17:30 there will be a press conference concerning the 33rd America’s Cup.
To watch a live web stream from Port America’s Cup; connect to http://www.americascup.com
Regards
Please, don’t tell me that Valencia won’t be the next cup’s location!!!!!!
It ‘s absolutely perfect!!!
I am going to hear the press conference, I need to know as much as possible about the cup….
Vale: cool off, if BMWO win the court case, and the water race, then the next cup will be in 2009, if they lose the water race after winning the court case then, it will be in 2009, if they come to an agreement then it will be in 2009, in Valencia.
As too if it says there past 2009 ? ( I’m sorry but it better bloody not be in Valencia, Alinghi needs to be taken out of the cup along with it’s underhanded cheating tactics.)
I’m sure Pete will be happy to see the stats when he gets back:
Blog Stats
100,122 views since Feb ’07
nice going!!
LOL, you know what if I’d never posted my video I doubt there’d have been any more posts
-=maybe=-
Speaking of Pete, where is he?
love his commentary for the fight between Alinghi and BMWO if it goes that far, “And there goes BMWO at 34.4 knots, Alinghi ? well they’ve not left the start line yet, but they look pretty mad!” lol
I would like to know something more about ETNZ and their presence in the next AC….. could you tell me something about that? Some news on TVNZ or from some kiwi sailing club?
Well there isn’t much news, other than the sailing team Dean & Co. want to stay together for the next one, Russel Coutts did approach Grant not the other way around but his asking price was too much and there wasn’t a place for him to fit in, so I think I can forgive Russel for his defection now, as for the rest? well “no body give me a gun” quote comes to mind.
They apparently “oddly” feel like piggy in the middle over the legal problems, I don’t understand why.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/ key to knowing anything about them at the moment it would appear.
thanks Tim, I check Nz herald almost daily…I love our team’s spirit, and according to me, despite the huge amount of money Russel will receive from BMW Oracle, he must feel a little bit sad to not have hopes to sail again with ETNZ.
It’s Valencia & 2009… http://www.americascup.com/en/33rd/news.php
So ETNZ is the latest Challenger!
Julian : ETNZ have not sent a challenge yet, I assume they won’t until this legal debarkel is over, (maybe).
vale : Very likely, but it’s a funny old game you know so anything could happen, he may end up sailing for TNZ again, would be nice put the cup back in America, then come back to TNZ and bring it back home again. lmao.
Erm, check the AC website. ETNZ are the fourth challenger.
I have pretty much zero respect for old Ernie now: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/event/story.cfm?c_id=531&objectid=10453751
The man has no nobility, no sense of respect, and is completely honor less, he is scum of the worst kind, but what else is new? we already knew that.
Happy to know ETNZ as the fourth challenger for the next cup!!!!!!!
About Ernie, I don’t have any respect for him! It is just a material man, without feelings, without humanity, without soul…WHAT A SHAME!!!!
GO NZ!!!! GO NEW ZEALANDERS!!!!!
Interview with Dean Barker:
“Dean Barker explains America’s Cup Challenges”
http://www.sail-world.com/news_printerfriendly.cfm?Nid=36028
Thank you Gary…so happy to hear from Deano…he’s my favourite!!!
Some more comment from ETNZ here too: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/event/story.cfm?c_id=531&objectid=10454049&pnum=0
any updates on ETNZ since they became the fourth challenger for the AC. Have we signed any one up yet? How are we going at retaining crew members?
ray davies is back for ETNZ! Great news: http://www.stuff.co.nz/sundaystartimes/4144652a6444.html
Good blog: http://sailjuice.blogspot.com/2007/07/buggers-muddle.html
good comments indeed Julian – also, Valencia Sailing are reporting news on a 2nd Spanish Challenger: http://valenciasailing.blogspot.com/
good comments indeed Julian –
also, Valencia Sailing are reporting news on a 2nd Spanish Challenger: http://valenciasailing.blogspot.com/
HI, again. Still lurking. A kinda funny story, but at the same time, a little worrying. Bear with me!
My mum had spinal surgery whilst the ‘finals’ were on, and was re-cooping at my house, as you can fathom, that will make one rather sore and unable to move around easily.
Anyway – ‘that race’ won by a sec by Adingy was so damn exciting I was pacing up and down, screaming at the TV while mum was layed out on my couch struggling to view the coverage, she was into it as much as I was.
Anyway, those last 5 minutes ( the whole race to be honest ) were something else, as I was jumping around, waving my hands and ‘coaxing’ Dean and the boys to the line, next thing I know my Mum is along side me jumping up and down screaming and wailing ‘come on boy’s’ with me.
Not until the line was crossed, I glanced at my ‘spinal injured mum’ and said to her:
” how the bloody hell did you get off that couch so damn fast – and what are you doing jumping around like that!”……!!!!!!!!!
As she hobbled back to the couch, she had NO recollection of even getting up and acting like a teenager!!!!!!!!! Funniest thing I have ever seen.
Just wanted to share with you all what the effect ETNZ had on us, I shall never forget that last race, the race before that, the race before that and so on.
Oh BTW: mum is doing well and looking forward to the next one LOL !!!!!!!!!!!
Great Story Blair!
Here’s part 2 of Dean Barkers interview on Sail-World
“Dean Barker looks back on America’s Cup 32″
http://www.sail-world.com/news_printerfriendly.cfm?Nid=36274
Great article Gary.
I love this bit: ‘Our assumption is that their domination in the class, and gap they have over other teams has decreased. They are probably not that comfortable with being able to stay ahead of the game for another America’s Cup cycle which is probably a motivation for them to change the class and play to their strength in boat design,’ Barker concluded.
Exactly what I thought was the motivation behind the 90ft boats.
Heh heh heh: http://bp1.blogger.com/_1CDZ7Ya8Ni0/Rq_X3aLnbJI/AAAAAAAAAvc/FcYPh4t0U74/s1600-h/three_amigos.jpg
Sucks to hear Prada are no more
http://www.cupinfo.com/en/prada-33-press1.php
Things are hotting up eh? http://www.cupinfo.com/en/mascalzone-33-press1.php
Hi Julian – yes, it’s very sad news to see Bertelli withdraw. I’ve always thought that Prada and later Luna Rossa Challenge were fantastic ambassadors for Italy, always very slick and stylish, their base in Valencia was one of the best looking without doubt
I’m sure our friend Giulio Z is not a happy man now!
On the subject of Vicenzo Oranato & Mascalzone Latino – I guess we’ve found the answer to my earlier comment in this thread “Vincenzo Oronato (ML) was pretty outspoken about how powerless the Challenger Commission was in the run up to AC32 – I wonder how he feels now!”
This just in from Valencia Sailing:
“Friday, August 03, 2007
Russell Coutts: GGYC will withdraw lawsuit if Alinghi accepts Onorato’s proposals
Russell Coutts, CEO of BMW Oracle Racing, is currently in Palma, taking part in the Copa del Rey. He is calling tactics aboard Artemis, the Swedish TP52 boat.
Valencia Sailing talked to Coutts moments after the end of Friday’s racing and asked him to comment Vicenzo Onorato’s proposals concerning the 33rd America’s Cup, published earlier today.
Coutts was very straightforward in his statement. He shares the view of Onorato for a fair America’s Cup, agrees with the proposals put forward by the Italian and if Alinghi accepts them, GGYC will withdraw the lawsuit filed at the New York Supreme Court.”
Hi Guys!! I am in Auckland…I have just arrived, ready for a kiwi adventure!!!! I am going to read all you wrote about AC last news…
Ciao Ciao!
Vale
Gary – That is good to hear. I like Onorato’s proposal. No 90 footers till next Cup. Would give the Teams a chance to breathe!
Vale – Awesome! You’ll have to let me know what it’s like aboard NZL40/41!
Latest from the NZ Herald: “Team NZ angry about America’s Cup delays”
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/4/story.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=10455894
Guys, I didn’t known Luna Rossa won’t be part in the next AC!!! I am very sad about it. I am not a LR fan, as you know, but I am sorry about this decision taking in count that the cause are all the changes imposed by Bertarelli.
I would like to go to Auckland ETNZ base to search some news about the next AC….
Julian, I am going to sail the harbour on NZL40/41 as soon as possible, an I am going to tell you everything about that
MESSAGE FOR PETER
PETER WHERE ARE YOU NOW? I SENT YOU AN EMAIL, IF YOU CAN, PLEASE, ANSWER ME.
THANK YOU.
REGARS
VALE
Hi mates,
I’ve just come back home (I was on holidays) to hear the bad news about Luna Rossa…
I’m very sad.
I’ve no words
Giulio,
Yes I was also saddened by this. It is because of what Bertarelli is doing with the protocol I think, all the teams are upset. Perhaps we can have a Louis Vuitton challenge in place of AC?
Ciao Guilio, good to see you back, and it’s sad that you’ve come back to the news about Luna Rossa
UITG have challenged for the 33rd also:
http://fresh17.de/
although, no mention of it on americascup.com?!
Ciao Giulio, I am sorry and I don’t understand why LN took the decision…:-(
Ciao ragazzi.
I’m sure that if TNZ had won the Cup everything would have been different.
Thanks for the support!
Let’s see what will happen!
Mascalzone Latino too is in doubt I think.
Have you read the letter written by Vincenzo Onorato to Alinghi and SNG?
http://www.mascalzonelatino.it/home/dettaglio_news.jsp?ID=886
PS
On Valencia sailing you can listen to an interview to Peter Lester about Luna Rossa not competing for the next AC.
http://valenciasailing.blogspot.com/
Why don’t they just abandon the AC and establish a world-cup. Every other sport seems to have a world-cup. Wouldn’t this become more prestigious than the AC?
Good point Mike. The problem with the America’s Cup is the history behind it, the fact that it’s the oldest sporting trophy in the world etc. Some billionaires will do almost anything to get their hands on it
I’d still like to see Louis Vuitton create their own series. Anyone noticed that the two big fashion labels are out of the AC? Coincidence? I think not.
Did you guys see this? http://www.fuxiachallenge.com/
I could really get into watching that team sail!
LOL – had read about them on mariantic a while ago –
Does anyone else think it’s strange that there’s still no mention of UITG’s challenge for the 33rd cup on americascup.com? http://33rd.americascup.com/en/ it’s been reported everywhere else but there, surely ACM would want to trumpet every new challenge??
Ok I’m in shock that this has even been suggested as a rumour!!
from: http://valenciasailing.blogspot.com/
Dean Barker to move to BMW Oracle ??
Valencia Sailing has a strict policy of not reproducing rumors in its three years of existence. The only time we didn’t follow the rules was a couple of months ago when we wrote about the imminent contract signature between Russell Coutts and BMW Oracle. It turned out it was true and the news was officially announced a month after we mentioned it. Still, it seems the contacts between the kiwi sailor and the American team were Valencia’s worst kept secret.
We will deviate from our policy for a second time and report the information we have received concerning the transfer of Dean Barker, the helmsman of Emirates Team NZ in the 32nd America’s Cup, to BMW Oracle. It seems, again officially unconfirmed, that the young New Zealander has signed or is about to sign an agreement with Russell Coutts, the brand new CEO of BMW Oracle, in order to become the helmsman on the American team.
It is a plausible rumor given the fact Dean Barker was in Palma last Saturday and was seen at the yacht club. Palma was of course where the Copa del Rey took place last week and Russell Coutts was calling tactics aboard the Swedish TP52 boat Artemis. It is believed Barker was not in the Spanish city for holidays but in order to have talks with Coutts. Unlike 2006, Barker hasn’t taken take part in any of the Breitling Medcup races so far this year.
Even if this information turns out to be false, Larry Ellison, owner of BMW Oracle, will have no choice but to sign a very big name, and there aren’t a lot of them available. The only other name we can think of is James Spithill, the young Australian helmsman of now defunct Luna Rossa.
Once again, this information has not been officially confirmed or denied by any of the involved parties. It might turn out to be that Barker’s presence in Palma was only related to his interest in the TP52 circuit and his view that it can provide an excellent training tool for any America’s Cup team.
A load of crap I can confirm this because, he was the second person “SIGNED” with ETNZ for the 33rd America’s Cup, right after Grand Dalton .
O guys…don’t tell me news like this!!!! Yesterday I went to the port here in Auckland and I saw ETNZ base…but there was nobody around…
Vale: it is complete rubbish.
The boys are just out in the world doing there research / sailing and what not, life goes on after the AC.
word from the man himself:
Barker douses rumour over move to Oracle
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/4/story.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=10456816
Yeah, also here: http://www.stuff.co.nz/4158827a1823.html
Victory Challenge are with Vincenzo Onorato:
“Victory Challenge calls upon SNG to listen to Vincenzo Onorato”
http://www.bymnews.com/news/newsDetails.php?id=13241
Hehe .. told you
just kidding.
From Scuttlebutt: http://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=post_attachment;postatt_id=439;
Here’s the (empty) filing on the New York Supreme Court Website:
http://iapps.courts.state.ny.us/iscroll/AdvSearch.jsp?SDate=14-Aug-2004&EDate=14-Aug-2007&Criteria=Golden%20Gate%20Yacht%20Club&CID=2&DID=2
I need to get out more, lol – -
Wheels falling off the cart?
Jochen Schumann has left Alinghi
http://www.sport1.de/de/sport/artikel_1563908.html
It’s in german, but you’ll get the jist. I’m sure the boys in UITG are knocking down his door!
Yeah, I remember reading a rumour about him leaving a month or so ago. Still questions over whether UITG’s new boat will actually be allowed!
What exactally did Jochen Schumann do for Alinghi, I don’t keep up with the internals of Alinghi, because well there is no polite way to say this despite winning the AC I still think there trash.
That’s a good question Tim. His official title was “sports director” – the kind of job you give someone you want to keep on your team, without them actually doing anything
Excellent editorial comment from Richard Gladwell @ Sail-World:
“America’s Cup sailor and commentator, Gary Jobson takes Alinghi and their commercial arm, America’s Cup management to task for their actions following the 32nd America’s Cup.”
http://www.sail-world.com/news_printerfriendly.cfm?Nid=36814
Hi guys!!! Yesterday I spent all day sailing in in Pahia ( Northland) The wind was very good, and every time we changed direction It has been a strong emotion ’cause we have to move so quickly to take the right wind…..WONDERFUL!!!!
Cool Vale!
More comment on the whole AC33 debacle: http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070820/SPORTS10/708200336/1058
So much for all the talk of negotiations going on behind the scenes, this from ggyc.com:
“Golden Gate granted court order to advance America’s Cup resolution
New York, NY (August 22, 2007) – The Supreme Court of the State of New York today granted an order sought by the Golden Gate Yacht Club (GGYC) requiring the Société Nautique de Genève (SNG) to promptly answer a request to speed up the legal process for resolving its proposed new rules for defending the next America’s Cup.
The San Francisco club sought the Court ruling alleging SNG is in serious breach of its fiduciary duty under the Deed of Gift that governs the Cup. It says SNG has accepted an invalid challenge from a sham yacht club, and is seeking to impose an unprecedented one-sided set of rules that hugely favor the defender to the detriment of all other competitors.
“We are very pleased with this ruling by the Court, because we believe the Cup will be irrevocably damaged if we don’t get SNG’s Protocol changed,” Tom Ehman, Head of External Affairs for BMW ORACLE Racing, the US club’s team, said.
“The new Protocol would give SNG’s team, Alinghi, radical new powers to control nearly all aspects of the event that are still unsupported by any explanation from SNG as to why they are needed,” he said.
Ehman said the syndicate whose challenge had been accepted by SNG, the Club Náutico Español de Vela (CNEV), was a shell organisation that had been formed only days prior to issuing a challenge and did not comply with the terms specified by the Deed of Gift.
“We would still prefer to negotiate a solution outside the court, but we see SNG as violating its responsibilities as Trustee, and we are fully prepared to go the legal distance if needed to stop the America’s Cup being subverted into a hopelessly one-sided event,” he said.
The Deed of Gift that protects the Cup as a perpetual sporting challenge is governed by a fiduciary trust established under New York law in 1887.
The GGYC court action also seeks a preliminary injunction to obtain critical information related to the club’s challenge under the Deed of Gift.
The American challenge is for a race next summer under the Deed’s 10-month rule. GGYC need to know where SNG intends to hold that competition and what the SNG sailing rules are. Under the Deed, the Swiss Defender is required to provide these important details to the Challenger.
GGYC filed a challenge on July 11th, and asserts that SNG must accept it. If successful in this motion, the GGYC case could be heard by the Courts as early as October 2007.”
the case number is 602446/2007 and looks like the first court appearance is shceduled for the 9th of September at 2pm. The motion that is being sought is a preliminary injunction / restraining order
Great, so if they Alinghi keep there head down, and don’t actually do anything, BMWO can just walk in to the display cabinet of the ACup and walk out the door with it, without even getting on boat, guess Alinghi has to learn the lesson some problems don’t go away by just IGNORING them.
So whens the press release about ray davies joining oracle?
This can’t be good for CNEV: http://nz.entertainment.yahoo.com/070829/5/1h85.html
Is Ray Davies joining Oracle? Not Good news for ETNZ
Again don’t believe any of that tripe we had Dean Barker joining Oracle last month too.
It would seem to me that the validity of the GGYC is a separate issue from that of CNEV. Am I right? Even if CNEV is found to be a valid COR, the issue of the GGYC challenge would still have to be addressed. Can it be said to be invalid?
“validity of the GGYC challenge” I should have said
Oh no!! http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/4/story.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=10465904
NOOOOOOO!!!!
Wheres the problem there…my view is Terry was one of the main reasons we lost a number of the races against Alinghi, especially doing our penalty turn so far away from the line…time to go shopping for a star I think!
Terry is one of the reasons we got through the Louis Vuitton in the first place. The media wants a scapegoat for us not winning against Alinghi. Instead of focusing on the fact that TeamNZ pretty much rebuilt itself after the failures on 2003, lets go after the tactician instead? What a load of crap.
Terry, you will be missed mate. I for one appreciate your involvement with our team.
I’m not saying Terry WAS the only reason we lost, however there were a few critical errors made that lead to our defeat(s) and as we all know tacticians take a fair chunk of the blame. G.Daltons comments dont sound like a man that is in total despair about the decision either. To be honest its the media’s job to be critical, people want to read about why the team lost, I feel most people would agree there were mistakes made. The media also did focus a great deal on how well New Zealand did do to re-build and get themselves into contention and I dont think they signalled Terry out for any harsh judgement at all.
Hi Guys…I read the news and I am very sad, ’cause I like Terry very much…
anyway, what about the ETNZ tactitians for the next AC?
Cheers
Vale
Supposedly Ray Davies will get the job. But then they have to find someone to replace him as strategist.
BTW, Vale…I’m dying to hear how you got on with the sailing in Auckland!
What’s this? No more “tight five”?! http://www.stuff.co.nz/4218213a1823.html
looks like that one’s been removed Julian, what did it say?
I’m guessing it had something to do with this:
Alinghi sailor Simon Daubney has arrived home with his wife and children after quitting the Swiss America’s Cup-winning team following positive drugs tests.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/category/story.cfm?c_id=106&objectid=10468368
Yep, spot on.
HI!!! i CAN’T POST ANYTHING HERE AND I DON’T KNOW WHY…..
UAOOOO!! NOW IT WORKS!!!!!
Gidday Julian!!! I am sorry for my delay to tell you the wonderful sailing experience in Auckland, but in these last times I have been so busy!! But now I am back!
Anyway, I took NZL41 and I drove it!!! Uaooooo! I felt like Dean Barker!! Amazing!!! It was of the most beautiful experience I have been in my life!!! The wind was 12 knots…it was like flying!!!
Julian, I don’t remember where you live…but you have to go to Auckland to take NZL41!!!!!
I went also to Paihia, in the Northland, and I sailed for six hours!!!!! Fantastic!!!!
Now I am in Italy…and I miss NZ so much!!
When I came back to Rome I went to Fiumicino to watch a stage of the World Cup, and I met Russell Coutts!!! We took pictures together!!! SO WONDERFUL!!!!!
Talking about Alinghi, and the last news about doping…..THERE ARE NO WORDS!!! Why not cancel the result and repeat the competition!!!!!
Cheers
Vale
Congrats Vale, that sounds awesome. You met Coutts too? Lucky! Yes, I will have to take a trip up to Auckland and check out NZL40/41…one day!
10 days to go until court day.
Hey Peter the class where it all started for you is having it’s 50th Anniversary NZ dinner at Takapuna Boating club this saturday. As an important part of the classes NZ history and a past world champion you should be there! The event will be hosted by Peter Montgomery with many past and most current OK sailors there. Please contact Alistair Deaves at alistair@deaves.com to buy your ticket…look forward to seeing you there.
what ya think about the NY court decision?
About time
Now it appears ol’Ernie is going to throw his toys out of the cot because he didn’t get his way (in other words, ruin the AC for good by getting rid of all the tradition).
Hey vale…you must come back
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/CU0712/S00226.htm
Hi guys.
it’s a long time since I’ve been here!
Happy 2008 from an old friend!
Giulio
Hi vuys.
it's a long time since I've been here!
Happy 2008 frim an old friend!
Giulio;